Tyreke not improving

[prostacker]

Tyreke looks like the same player he was as a rookie. Making the same mistakes, I am not seeing the progression one would assume he would make. The kings are not going to improve unless he picks his play up. I would like to see more from him as a 3rd year player.

[nuraman00]

I agree. He's been a little better on defense this year, but other than that, he hasn't improved.

[Eze]

Think it's his bball IQ. He has a ton of talent, but, just doesn't seem to understand how to play a team game or how to take it to the next level when it's needed, say like a Rose.

He'll always be a stat magnet, but he needs to learn how to play the game. The fact that he was complaining last night about everybody else when he was just as guilty was pretty bad.

[nuraman00]

Think it's his bball IQ. He has a ton of talent, but, just doesn't seem to understand how to play a team game or how to take it to the next level when it's needed, say like a Rose.

He'll always be a stat magnet, but he needs to learn how to play the game. The fact that he was complaining last night about everybody else when he was just as guilty was pretty bad.

Can you repost what he said/did?

[Eze]

Can you repost what he said/did?

I think Jason Jones or Marcos Brenton posted it on Twitter, but, they said that Evans told them nobody was talking on defense except for Chuck Hayes, and that everybody was lost outside of Chuck.

It was kinda like - okay, and why weren't you talking? lol

[KingsOwn19]

He was better in his rookie year

[Eze]

Think teams have better game plans - know what to expect better.

[bloatedmaniac]

Tyreke is 100% about driving to the hoop, and so teams begin to collapse on him right away. He needs to be more creative with his movements and desperately needs to develop a shot outside of practice. In his third season there has been no growth to his game. His passing has not improved, his defense is about what it was his first year, his shot still blows, his whole mindset is still the same, and still no midrange game.

Look at Durant in his first 3 years and you see growth in his shot selection, defense, and how to adjust to oppossing defenses.

Tyreke spends two offseasons working on his three point shot with zero results. He needs to take a page from Beno's book and develop a midrange game first. He'll get a lot of open looks and make defense respect him a whole lot more. When he gets a fluid shot from 12-15 feet it'll allow him to adjust to three point shooting better.

[Eze]

Well, at least Tyreke got it for a night.

Per Sean from Channel 10:


Tyreke Evans said he was so unhappy with his FT shooting that he came back in gym after game to shoot over 400 FT's til 2am

[BosnianBaller_]

yeah i was expecting a big season from tyreke. derrick rose and russell westbrook really broke out in their 3rd season and they are the most comparable players that i can think of to tyreke. he just doesn't see the floor as well as he should. and his jump shot is still suspect. i don't know, maybe we expected too much after his 20-5-5 rookie season

[kingraider412]

The problem is obvious! we don't have a true point. Reke and Thornton don't fit the bill here. 13 assists? You will not win many games with that stat.

It speaks volumes for the fact, we either need to trade for one, or draft one next year. Unless, Jimmer becomes that guy.

Reke is a nice complimentary piece a number 2, if you will. Based on what the sample size of three seasons. Thornton has a more aggressive, cold blodded attitude, so for now he should be option 1.

If we had a decent pg, Cousins would be even more effective. What made the Adelman Kings a perennial playoff team was everyone passed the ball with great precision.

This team does not have a clue.

[Eze]

With Jimmer and Reke, along with Thornton, you have no room for an additional PG type player though. Kings would have to move one of them.

[nuraman00]

I'm not ready to write off Evans-Thornton yet. I think the offense just needs to change internally, to work through the bigs.

Evans and Thornton started together for 7 games last year. The Kings averaged 21.7 assists in that span. So I think the 13 assists was just a bad game by the whole team. They weren't able to figure out what to do.

4 of those 7 games were the road, and against Houston, San Antonio, and Memphis.

Even if Evans doesn't improve, he and the rest of the team can still play better than they've shown. If they work through the bigs more.

[EvansCousinsDUO]

He might not be showing it yet but at least he is trying.

"Tyreke Evans said he was so unhappy with his free throw shooting that he came back in gym after game to shoot over 400 FT’s until 2am"
https://twitter.com/#!/News10Sean/status/152884962796908544

Regarding Cunningham’s tweet: I left Power Balance Pavilion yesterday evening, a little after midnight. As I was walking to my car, I passed by a father and his young son, who were parked behind the player’s entrance at the practice facility. I asked them if they were waiting to get an autograph from anyone in particular. The father told me that Evans’ brother, Doc said that Tyreke was inside the facility. Knowing that most players clear the premises within an hour or so after each game, I was slightly skeptical. Turns it out, I was wrong.

[nuraman00]

He might not be showing it yet but at least he is trying.

"Tyreke Evans said he was so unhappy with his free throw shooting that he came back in gym after game to shoot over 400 FT’s until 2am"
https://twitter.com/#!/News10Sean/status/152884962796908544 (https://twitter.com/#%21/News10Sean/status/152884962796908544)

Regarding Cunningham’s tweet: I left Power Balance Pavilion yesterday evening, a little after midnight. As I was walking to my car, I passed by a father and his young son, who were parked behind the player’s entrance at the practice facility. I asked them if they were waiting to get an autograph from anyone in particular. The father told me that Evans’ brother, Doc said that Tyreke was inside the facility. Knowing that most players clear the premises within an hour or so after each game, I was slightly skeptical. Turns it out, I was wrong.

Thanks. Can someone show me a picture of where the practice facility is in relation to the Power Balance Pavilion?

[Gunshot]

With Jimmer and Reke, along with Thornton, you have no room for an additional PG type player though. Kings would have to move one of them.

The Kings "master plan" is already murky
when you think about it, eventually Tyreke is the odd man out IMO

not saying it's time to give up on him or "lets trade em"
just don't see how he fits in down the road

[Gunshot]

Thanks. Can someone show me a picture of where the practice facility is in relation to the Power Balance Pavilion?

Right side of pic

81

[bloatedmaniac]

I completely agree with you, and think the Kings should run the offense through Cousins. It worked out well for the team toward the end of last season and Cousins probably would welcome the chance. Tyreke obviously can't run the offense, nor can Thornton, or Jimmer yet. Thornton and Jimmer can play well enough off the ball since they are good shooters, and Tyreke can learn to do backdoor cuts like Miller/Martin used to do for easy points. Without a true point guard, it really is the best chance. The offense will always be a bit funky with too many shoot first players, but at least you have a solid point of emphasis.

As far as Tyreke not fitting in the future plan, I agree. His ideal fit, would be point guard if he could learn to break down the defense with his driving ability to create open shots for others. Instead he still plays like a shooting guard, but he isn't ideal as a two guard with this team since he can't shoot for crap. Thornton has become a more bonafide 2 and a guy you can trust to make big shots. I'd hate to trade Tyreke to another team, and watch him become a legit beast, but you can wait only so long.

[nuraman00]

Right side of pic

81

Ok, so is it in a different side of the street altogether, or still within the same Power Balance Pavilion parking lot?

If it's within the same parking lot, then all EvansCousinsDUO (http://kingsforum.net/live/member.php?54-EvansCousinsDUO) had to do was just go over to that side of the lot, right?

[nuraman00]

I completely agree with you, and think the Kings should run the offense through Cousins. It worked out well for the team toward the end of last season and Cousins probably would welcome the chance. Tyreke obviously can't run the offense, nor can Thornton, or Jimmer yet. Thornton and Jimmer can play well enough off the ball since they are good shooters, and Tyreke can learn to do backdoor cuts like Miller/Martin used to do for easy points. Without a true point guard, it really is the best chance. The offense will always be a bit funky with too many shoot first players, but at least you have a solid point of emphasis.

As far as Tyreke not fitting in the future plan, I agree. His ideal fit, would be point guard if he could learn to break down the defense with his driving ability to create open shots for others. Instead he still plays like a shooting guard, but he isn't ideal as a two guard with this team since he can't shoot for crap. Thornton has become a more bonafide 2 and a guy you can trust to make big shots. I'd hate to trade Tyreke to another team, and watch him become a legit beast, but you can wait only so long.

I didn't like it as much last year when the offense ran through Cousins, as I thought it rendered Evans useless for too long.

But based on the play this year, they have to go back to it.

Also, I still think Evans can fit in future plans, if he just makes a few improvements. Evans-Thornton backcourt could be as good as Ellis-Curry, for example. Not perfect, but pretty good.

And I'm not sure if Fredette is a future starting PG on a good team more than Evans, for different reasons.

1. Not many teams are good when the PG is the best shooter. Now it's still a leap to call Fredette the best shooter, as we have to see what his averages are at the end of the season. But it creates a weird dynamic.

Also, I'm not saying this is Nash's fault, but Nash is an example of a PG being the team's best shooter. And he's never been to the NBA Finals. Again though, not saying that's because of him, just an observation. Overall he's a HOF player so not his fault.

2. Fredette is small. He's going to have to do a few things to make this work:

Offense: Make floaters over taller guys like Tony Parker. We know he can get in the paint, he's medium-quick.
Defense: Take charges and play a little rough like Derek Fisher.

Yes the Bulls won with Steve Kerr at starting PG. But they had a scorer and ball handler and defender in Michael Jordan. Marcus Thornton and Tyreke Evans aren't at that level.

Right now, the best bet is to hope Evans can either get better, or reduce his mistakes.

If the Kings have to trade him, it should be for another starting PG IMO.

[Eze]

Jimmer's unique. You don't really normally see that kind of ability from a player of that size or that plays the "PG" position.

I guess Nash, in terms of scoring, is the most relative player that you can compare him to because of the ability to hit from the outside and efficient style of scoring but Jimmer's light years behind in actual PG skills, so even then it's a tough comparison.

Jimmer's going to be too good to be a sixth man type down the road, so, I think you'll have to compliment your roster with pieces that can interchange on defense to make up for his lack of size and speed. I think you'll eventually see Jimmer guarding a lot of the "shooter" types - Kaponos, etc. until he learns how to play defense better.

[nuraman00]

Jimmer's unique. You don't really normally see that kind of ability from a player of that size or that plays the "PG" position.

I guess Nash, in terms of scoring, is the most relative player that you can compare him to because of the ability to hit from the outside and efficient style of scoring but Jimmer's light years behind in actual PG skills, so even then it's a tough comparison.

Jimmer's going to be too good to be a sixth man type down the road, so, I think you'll have to compliment your roster with pieces that can interchange on defense to make up for his lack of size and speed. I think you'll eventually see Jimmer guarding a lot of the "shooter" types - Kaponos, etc. until he learns how to play defense better.

I'd agree with that. I'd just like this backcourt to work as his, because Evans, Thornton, and Fredette all are pretty good players, and all could average about 32 minutes if they could ever become an efficient backcourt that cut down on their current mistakes.

Teams have had 3 main guards all who were too good to come off the bench before.

But maybe it never materializes. Maybe Evans will continue to not get the offense going, while Thornton reverts to being a scorer, and Fredette passes it to 5 players before he takes a shot. Lol.

[Eze]

The team, at least IMO, usually goes as Tyreke goes. If Tyreke is driving into the lane, that leaves Thornton (and in due time Jimmer) open on the wings for the deep threat. Tyreke's cutting (along with Thornton's) allows elbow play from Hayes/Cousins, opening up the paint for lay-ins.

If Tyreke isn't penetrating, it doesn't force the defense to collapse. If it doesn't collapse, there aren't any open shots. If he's not cutting, Cousins and Hayes are forced to pass out of the post towards the three point line, rather than inside.

His skill set works wonders for the team (probably why Petrie built the roster the way he did) but he has to do the things required from him to help the team win. Reke's physical gifts are all there, it's mental to me. He's always relied on his size and athletic ability to get by and while they are still extremely helpful at the NBA level, he never had to use a mental game in high school and during his small time frame at PG at Memphis. He could just out-muscle and out-race everybody, now, he needs to take the next level with the mental game and understand how to make his teammates better which will in turn make him better.

Yes, he needs to work on the jumper/three ball as he's done the past two offseasons, but, more importantly, he needs to learn the game. He has physical gifts that will let the shooting come in time, at least to a respectable level - it's the mental game, the understanding of it he lacks. He plays dumb. Westbrook and Rose played dumb too when they came into the league - but they've learned the game (Westbrook to a lesser level than Rose) - that's where Evans really needs to improve, at least for me.

[nuraman00]

The team, at least IMO, usually goes as Tyreke goes. If Tyreke is driving into the lane, that leaves Thornton (and in due time Jimmer) open on the wings for the deep threat. Tyreke's cutting (along with Thornton's) allows elbow play from Hayes/Cousins, opening up the paint for lay-ins.

If Tyreke isn't penetrating, it doesn't force the defense to collapse. If it doesn't collapse, there aren't any open shots. If he's not cutting, Cousins and Hayes are forced to pass out of the post towards the three point line, rather than inside.

His skill set works wonders for the team (probably why Petrie built the roster the way he did) but he has to do the things required from him to help the team win. Reke's physical gifts are all there, it's mental to me. He's always relied on his size and athletic ability to get by and while they are still extremely helpful at the NBA level, he never had to use a mental game in high school and during his small time frame at PG at Memphis. He could just out-muscle and out-race everybody, now, he needs to take the next level with the mental game and understand how to make his teammates better which will in turn make him better.

Yes, he needs to work on the jumper/three ball as he's done the past two offseasons, but, more importantly, he needs to learn the game. He has physical gifts that will let the shooting come in time, at least to a respectable level - it's the mental game, the understanding of it he lacks. He plays dumb. Westbrook and Rose played dumb too when they came into the league - but they've learned the game (Westbrook to a lesser level than Rose) - that's where Evans really needs to improve, at least for me.

I agree.

[cbkesq]

Evans for Holiday (Reke from PA). Does Philly say no? I wanted the Kings to draft Holiday instead of Evans in the first place. He is more of a PG and can make others better. Does not dominate the ball either. Also, the track record of players coming out of UCLA under Howland is astounding, especially guards. Almost all of them perform above where they are drafted.

[nuraman00]

Evans for Holiday (Reke from PA). Does Philly say no? I wanted the Kings to draft Holiday instead of Evans in the first place. He is more of a PG and can make others better. Does not dominate the ball either. Also, the track record of players coming out of UCLA under Howland is astounding, especially guards. Almost all of them perform above where they are drafted.

Hey cbkesq (http://kingsforum.net/live/member.php?164-cbkesq). :)

If Evans doesn't improve this year, then I'd consider it. Holiday is ok.

Are you going to post your detailed scouting reports on Udrih again? :) (Or Evans, Thornton, Fredette to keep it more current).

[Gunshot]

IMO it would take more than Jrue

[kingraider412]

These next 3 games will be telling for both Reke and Westfail. I am almost jumping off the Reke train, unless we see some real consistency and improvement. We badly need a true point and Reke could be a very nice piece for some team looking for his type of game. A solid pt will turn Cuz into a real threat down low.

[Eze]

Reke just needs to learn the game. He's a pretty unique talent. If he ever learns how to play and just stops relying on his athletic ability, he'd be a force. Hard to give up on that - but frustrating to watch him not grow.

He shows you flashes than make you go, holy crap, but continues to revert.

[ctba]

whoooo whooooooo choooo chooooo

[cbkesq]

Hey cbkesq (http://kingsforum.net/live/member.php?164-cbkesq). :)

If Evans doesn't improve this year, then I'd consider it. Holiday is ok.

Are you going to post your detailed scouting reports on Udrih again? :) (Or Evans, Thornton, Fredette to keep it more current).

Ironically in trading Beno, they brought back another nonfavorite of mine in Salmons. This season is going to be painful to watch in terms of playmaking. As much as I think this team has a lot more talent than years' past, I predict they will be worst in the league in terms of assist numbers and assist/to ratio. UGGGH!